Comparing Stats

April 15, 2008 at 2:30 pm (Guide, Hunter, Warcraft, World of Warcraft)

There are a lot of useful stats to hunters. It can be a bit hard figuring out if an item is an upgrade or not. Does 12 hit help more than 14 crit? 48 AP or 30 Agi? If you’ve ever wondered this, the nice guys over at TKAsomthing came up with HAEPs (Hunter Agility Equivalency Points). AEP was a system devised by rogues to help them easily compare stats on gear, and hunters have taken the system and adopted it to their combat system. But since ours involves more stats, it gets more complex fast.

Actually, the best way to test if something is an upgrade is to download Cheeky’s spreadsheet, update it with your information, and see if the theoretical DPS goes up or down. If you’re out in the world tho, HAEP provides a quick and dirty way (which may or may not work all the time). What HAEP actually does is give a value to each stat. Multiply the values by the stats on the armors and you can compare totals. The most basic stat values I start with are:

10 / Agi
9 / Crit Rating
5 / AP
12 / Hit Rating

I warn you that I value crit a bit more than others. 10, 8, 6, 13 respectively are what most run with. If you are interested in your particular specs theoretical values check this link. A few things to note here. First, Hit Rating is capped. If you’re raiding you need a max of 142 hit rating (96 with surefooted), but if you’re just doing PvP or soloing level 70 mobs you only need 79 HR (32 with SF). Once you get beyond that, extra points are worth 0. Until then it’s the most ‘valuable’ stat. I keep the highest hit rating item for each slot in my bank to swap out but stay close to cap.

Second, you should come up with your own numbers. I like crit, you may not. You might be a survival hunter with lightning reflexes, which automatically means Agi is 15% more valuable. You can also get an approximate HAEP directly from the first page of the spreadsheet. Under ‘Settings and Results’ look at the box with headings “Attribute | DPS | Per Item Budget.” To get your values, divide the number under DPS by (Agility+1)’s DPS and multiply by 10. Mine says I should use 10, 8.7, 5, 12.8, pretty close to what I was already using.

Third, the value of crit changes drastically between specs. After 25% crit, you’ve maxed your GftT focus regen. Around that same time, you’ve probably maxed out your Kill Commands. On the other hand, it continues to be more useful for SV hunters’ Expose Weakness and Thrill of the Hunt. Of course it’s always useful for DPS as well.

Comparing these totals tells you DPS comparison. I like the look of my Sunroc Mask of the Bandit, but how much dps do I lose when I take off my Gladiator’s Chain Helm? Well the mask has 23 Agi and 46 AP for 460 points. The helm has 34 Agi, 36 AP, and 20 Crit for 700. Well that’s what you get when you compare a level 62 BoE with a 70 epic. Well, let’s try my Stalker’s Helm of Second Sight. That’s 31 Agi, 60 AP for 610 points, not to mention that it has 3 gem slots instead of 2 which puts it pretty close gemming with Delicate Living Rubies. Did I mention that my DPS actually went down when I upgraded to epics, because I had used this method when questing?

Unless you really want to, you can stop here. Most of the other statistics will come on their own. You don’t need to go out of your way to get sta, int, mp5, resilience. If you need them, they’re probably already on your gear. All it’s really useful for is knowing if you want a resilience enchant or a stamina.  You probably don’t want to trade an AP gem for an int.

What happens when you run out of mana? Or worse yet, you die. Your DPS drops dramatically, especially if you’re dead. So longevity is also a factor. Int, Mp5 are extremely important to raiders, but I don’t personally include them in my evaluations. On the other hand Sta is useful for both. And is Spirit is the soloist’s new best friend? Here’s what I’d use:

6 / Int
10 / Mp5
2 / Spirit
4 / Stamina

Ok, where’d I get these numbers from. Let’s start with Mp5. For each point, I get 12 mana per minute. In a 10 minutes that’s 1 extra steady shot or ~450 damage that I wouldn’t be able to do if I were OOM. So it increases my damage by 450damage/600s = .75 DPS. To me that’s worth ~10, but again, only if you go OOM. Additionally, Mp5 cuts out downtime while soloing (which I really like), so I bump it up a little.

Int for raiders, is all about putting off that OOM situation as long as possible. Additionally, Int increases Aspect of the Viper’s effectiveness (at best each point is worth .55 Mp5). As a soloist, it means back up for when I pull too many adds, or I get ganked. If you use AotV all the time it’s worth more to you because Int generates more mana. If you use AotH more, it’s probably worth even more because you’ll be OOM more.

Spirit. Sigh. We used to not care about spirit at all. The formula for out of combat mana generation is now (.046637) x Spirit x SquareRoot(Int). With my int, I get (.6) x Spirit. That means that Spirit is worth .6 Mp5, but only out of combat, so this is actually 0 when raiding. For soloing, suppose out of every minute, I’m fighting for 40s. That means I’d regen a whopping 2 mana for each point of Spirit in a minute, while 1 point of Mp5 would regen 12. So what’s a hunter to do? Personally, I’d find 2 level 70 1H’ers ‘of Spirit’ (+24 spr) to swap out when you’re not fighting. And if you really want some regen, put the +20 Spirit enchant on each. You’ll note that my values for Mp5 and Spirit mean that the value of 15 spirit is the same as 3 Mp5 for your conversion pleasure.

Stamina is much simpler explanation. If I had an item with 20 agility, I would be willing to swap it out for an item that had 50 Sta (4 / Sta), but probably not if it had only 40 Sta (5 / Sta). There’s also, infrequently, Health per 5 seconds. Since Mp5 can be thought of as helpful when OOM, the same can be said for Hp5. If you’re being hit a lot, it would be useful, but honestly, if you’re hit enough for this to be a valid stat, erm… let me state this in your language: “UR doin eet Rong.”

Ok, so the remaining stats are strength (not needed at all), block rating, block, spell damage, healing, spell haste, spell hit, spell crit, spell penetration, defense, parry rating, dodge rating, resistances (situational)…

Haste, armor penetration, resilience, and expertise. Are relatively new stats. Expertise lowers parry dodge chance, but since ranged attacks cannot be parried or dodged, it’s not a stat for you. Haste may or may not be of benefit. I’m at 1.97 and wouldn’t take any. If you have a 2.9 speed weapon and are going for 1:1 it may help a lot: possibly 15/ point. I consider armor penetration and resilience to be PvP stats, but they are useful PvE as well. Both give greater benefit the more you have, so if you’re going to take any, take as much as you can.

Hrm… we also need to talk about +damage with scopes at some point here…



  1. NaturalChaos said,

    No! Not Math! Now my head hurts :|

    That’s a lot of good information though. Thanks!

  2. Kolan said,

    Nice post. The new 2.4 items are making gear choice that much more confusing for me. I am a BM hunter and my mantra has always been +agi > +rap > +crit. As such I find my crit rating at around 21% is a lot lower than most of my peers. This has not however resulted in a loss of dps when compared to others. In fact 99% of the times I top dps in raids. I have recently decided to look to add to crit. I have also decided that I think the the new +haste items are going to be fantastic for my spec.



  3. Znodis said,

    As a BM (actually any spec) the effect of haste really depends on your weapons speed and sadly your lag.

    The reason is that if you’re using a 1:1 rotation, your dps of Steady shot is determined by the speed of your weapon. So for me that would be a 450 steady every 1.96s or 229.6 DPS. However, someone else with a 2.3 attack speed and all other things being equal will have 450/2.3 = 195.7 DPS. Haste will help that person a lot.

    But what about me? Well I have to deal with my reaction time, the delay on Auto Shot before it goes off (~.5s), lag between my client and the server, and the global cooldown (1.2s because of Serpents Swiftness). When you add all that extra stuff up, it comes to about 1.9s. If I were to have any haste that took me below that, it would be totally wasted.

    Similarly for MM or SV 3:2 rotations, having a bit slower weapon means you don’t clip your next auto shot too much. Adding lots of haste may put you closer to the 1:1, but in the mean time make your 3:2 much worse.

    I think most people (myself included) would enjoy having a bit of haste on their gear, but not if it takes away from some of the core stats.

  4. Greatdelle said,

    thank you so much for this post. I’m trying to understand hunter math and gear and this is super helpful. *runs off to configure AEP*

  5. Aspect of the Girl said,

    […] The Mystic Hunter’s Comparing Stats post. (Hunter Math and an add-on to help you figure it all […]

  6. Ghanur said,

    Never forget: crit rate is worth zero, if you don’t hit the target ;)

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